 | NORML News: RACE AND THE DRUG WAR: Cliff Thornton's Aotearoa tour |
 Clifford Wallace Thornton, Jr leads the US drug policy reform group Efficacy and is on the advisory board of NORML USA. He is touring New Zealand this summer spreading the word about racism and the drug war. STEPHEN MCINTYRE interviewed Cliff in Christchurch.
NORML News Summer 2003-4
CLIFF THORNTON'S mother died of a heroin overdose when he was 18, and as a result he wanted drugs laws to be harsher. Now he believes that if heroin had been legal and supervised by doctors, his mother might have lived a relatively safe life.
Cliff has spoken to over 150,000 people in civic organisations, community forms, debates and college presentations across the United States and Canada since 1998. At the invitation of the Mild Greens, Cliff Thornton is in New Zealand until early February, touring the country and talking with as many interested parties as possible.
Norml News: Cliff, what are the objectives of your New Zealand tour?
Clifford Thornton: Enhancing the position of drug policy reform in this country, and seeing that groups doing any type of drug policy reform are working together. I want to see them put forward bold initiatives, whether it be registering more people to vote, or doing things in kind such as writing letters to editors, putting on forums or speaking tours. If you're not being pro-active, then a lot isn't going to happen!
You've said that in New Zealand we should be pushing the medical marijuana issue.
I think that medical marijuana is a wedge issue. Your Minister of Health has the wherewithal to push this through, but it would be helpful to mobilise the general public. To do that you reach out and put forth with evangelist type work - speaking to different organisations and getting their support.
You and Peter Dunne have something in common - he calls medical marijuana 'the thin edge of the wedge'.
I think he's entirely correct, and I don't think it's anything we should be running from. We have voiced this time and time again that we are for the full legalisation of cannabis. First of all we give it to those who need it immediately because of excruciating circumstances, and we open the door for the full legalisation of it.
I've heard you discuss the poor economics of the drug war. Could you explain that?
About 20 years ago in the US it was predicted that when mandatory minimum sentences for drug charges were introduced then somewhere down the road the country would run into a budgetary crisis; and that's exactly what's happened. Forty eight states are now in a serious budgetary crisis because the increasing cost of drug sentencing, prison building, and law enforcement have just about put them out of business. Now they're scrambling to find ways to cut costs and one of those is by releasing prisoners. Between now and March about 600,000 prisoners arrested on mostly drug charges are going to be coming out, but within three years half of them will be back in prison for failing a simple piss test. If we don't take a more realistic approach the situation's going to implode.
By creating a self-perpetuating criminal culture?
Exactly. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy: the more stringent you become with these drug wars, the bigger mess you're going to create. The financial crisis resulting from the drug war will be the primary influence on future drug policy. Economics is very simple: either you have the money or you don't, and at present we don't! The correlation I'm making is that your country is poised to do the same thing - it's heading in the same direction!
You describe drug policy reform as being the conservative approach. How so?
The way I understand conservatism, when you go into business you go to make money, not create a mess where you lose money every year. And you have to run a government in a highly similar way. When you have a problem in your business and you're spending more money than you're taking then you've got to look at that. The US federal government is into its fourth decade of losing money in the drug war with the situation getting progressively worse. Insanity is having the same people at the table that created this shit. Insanity is believing that you can compete with an underground economy that is eight or nine times higher than yours. That's insanity, and that's what we're going through.
What is the perception in the US of the state of reform in NZ?
[US] NORML president Keith Stroup told me that you people really have a good organisation working, so the analysis is that we see you as a real viable force in making change. But like us you don't have the revenue, the time, or the resources to become even more effective and efficient. Being practical then you have to keep doing what you have been doing but more effectively and try to be smart about it. But the thing that's going to push this over the top is the economic issue. Your country is poised to make monumental change and if you legalise cannabis it would send a tidal wave around the rest of the world.
Cannabis reform here could change the rest of the world's thinking - it's as simple as that. New Zealand could have the system by the balls if you move this thing in the right direction. I want to be the catalyst to get that started. People here will see the economic argument pretty soon. Right now your government is dwelling on P, but that could just be the thing that will put you into the same hole as the US. Your government needs to recognise that the harder it clamps down, the further it spreads the problem around. This is how it always works: as many P dealers as you arrest, the same amount or more are going to appear and take their place. You guys have the opportunity to move this thing forward. The potential in New Zealand is unbelievable. You have a country of 4 million people, you can get where ever you want to go in a couple of hours by plane, you have a lot of people in the government who are for this issue - some of them are outright blatant about it! Capitalise on that! Get the media and keep banging down their doors until they hear you; and one good way is not to talk about drug use, but talk about the economics and what you're doing with the issue and how it's spilling over to the people who don't even use drugs.
Cannabis here is more prevalent and out in the open than anywhere else in the world except Holland and perhaps Switzerland. I mean it's just out there. It's on every ballot and it's moving.
Cliff Thornton's Tour:
Monday December 8, 7:30: Public Lecture - Race, Class, Community and the War on Drugs, Wellness Center, Christchurch.
December 9-11: Parliament, Wellington.
December 17, 4:00pm: Burwood/Pegasus Community Board, Christchurch.
Cliff will be touring the North Island in January.
see www.mildgreens.com for further information and dates as they are confirmed, or contact Blair Anderson at blair @ mildgreens.com
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